Saturday, March 19, 2011

WHFB Orcs and Goblins Review: Part 6

Let's close this bad boy out with a look at the Specials and Rares.  This is usually where most armies get their mojo from, and OnG are no different.  The key is avoiding the overpriced, underpowered options that can easily lure you in.

Let's start with the one that will suck everyone in first...

Black Orcs:  Black Orcs are cool.  They are cool looking models, and have cool rules.  4+ armor save with shields, can use ADH, HWS, or GW.  Very cool.  They also get immune to psychology.  Very cool.  Now the uncool part: everything that kills normal Orcs still kills them, despite the armor.  And they cost 50% more than a Savage Orc, but the SO is just as killy.  Honestly, it isn't that they are too expensive for what they do, it's just that Savage Orc Big Uns do the same job way better for way cheaper, and come out of your core, not the much prized Specials slot.

Boar Boys: If for some reason you don't give Big Uns to your Savage Orcs, here is the unit to give it to.  This unit is insanely powerful on the charge, and thanks to M7 they will get it.  Give them shields, spears and make them Big Uns.  In a unit of 10.  With standard and musician, they clock in at a respectable 260 points and can take a magical standard of up to 50 points.  Remember how I said to put your Orc Warboss on a War Boar?  This is why.  This unit is a beast.  10 Str 6 attacks on the charge, 10 more str 5 from the pigs, 3+ armor save so they are survivable.  Give them the Razor Standard and they will filet nearly any unit in the game.  This is the elite hammer Black Orcs can never be.  What could top these?

Savage Boar Boys:  Yep these.  Try 15 strength 6 attacks on the charge backed up by 10 strength 5.  Only a 4+ armor save, but they get a 6+ ward.  And they are immune to psychology.  Yes, these are expensive and not for every list.  But they are strong stuff.

Boar Chariot:  Another nuts choice.  Check out Stelek's chariot spam list.  For 90 points you get... D6+1 Str 5 impact hits.  3 Strength 5 crew attacks.  And 2 Strength 5 boar attacks.  They only have a 4+ save but you can take enough of them to saturate the field, especially when you put cheap hero level dudes on them.

Goblin Wolf Chariot: Dirt Cheap.  Insanely powerful.  The amount of them you can bring in a list is staggering, as is the amount of impact hits they can deliver.  For a mere 150 points they deliver 3d6+3 Strength 5 impact hits.  That along is often enough to crush nearly anything.  And that's before the goblins and wolves swing.   They aren't super survivable, but you can take so many of them it's ridiculous.

Goblin Spear Chukka: Holy crap.  You can take up to 6 of them per army for 35 points each.  That's the easiest 210 points to spend ever.  I'd probably stick to 5 and clock in at 175.  These is where laying down the firepower stars.

Squig Hopper:  And here is the crap after a few good units.  These do nothing you'd want for a price you wouldn't want to pay.  The one benefit is they are skirmishers who are ITP meaning your opponent HAS to kill them to the last squig and he will likely have to do it in close combat.  But with all the gems in Special, pass on this.

Squiq Herder: Just say no to Squigs.

Snotlings: These are supposed to be a tarpit unit, but they really aren't capable of it.  They aren't Stubborn so they will just die.

Trolls: Man the models are so cool.  But the rules let them down.  LD4 and Stupidity.  Sigh.  If you don't have an Inspiring Presence bubble to baby sit them they just sit there waiting to be put out of their misery by every flaming unit ever.  Pass.


Onto the Rares.  The Spear Chukkas in the Specials are the base of your fire power, but this is where it get's nasty.
Goblin Rock Lobber: 170 points for two of these.  Automatic in every OnG army.  Don't argue, just accept it.  Stone throwers are nuts against the big blocks you will see, and since you can't count on magic to kill blocks like other armies, this is how you do it.  Most big blocks don't want to get hit by two of these a turn.  Tough luck.  I would pay for the Orc Bully with these to ensure the firepower keeps going.  Bring 4 at the 'Ard Boyz level.

Doom Diver Catapult: Another easy 160 points to spend in every army.  This is how you smash MSU elite armies.  You only need 3 at the 'ard Boyz level, but it's quite lovely watching Chaos Knights evaporate to these.

Snotling Pump Wagon:  Cheap and cute, but out of place.  The lack of reliability is the biggest problem, and generally you're better off with the above two machines of death.

Araknorak Spider:  The centerpiece model of the army.  Super tough and super killy.  Unfortunately, it's warmachine and magic bait.  You can only afford one at 2k points, and it's sure to die unless your opponent ignores it (!) and taking it means you are leaving warmachines at home.  Sorry, the warmachines play, this doesn't.  Save it for your spider themed fluff list.  That said, with one as a Shaman mount and one from Rare, you can have two and two could be tough, even for a cannon army to deal with before the pain train starts.  Still, my recommendation is that they are outshined by the more humble choices.

Squiqs, Trolls, and Giants: No, no, and no.  Unless you want to run some themed troll list with max trolls there is no need to bring them ever, and Warriors of Chaos does it better.

Well, it's been fun doing this review.  Next week I'll post some list ideas and put the OnG to bed.


  1. How do Black Orcs cost 50 percent more than Savage Orcs? BO are around 6 skaven slaves base, whereas SO are about 4 skaven slaves, and when you bring in SO Big un's its even further away, so I don't see where you got that. I'm seeing black orcs as more of the reliable versatile unit in an army, since they don't suffer from animosity, have better leadership and have the tools to kill everything; using 2 HW against hordes, S7 GW against heavy cav and inf.,etc.

    Troll also got a good boost from it getting cheaper and moved to the special slot, and hasn't been sending an Orc Big Boss to babysit them been used before anyways? I don't see how they're a pass now that they have supporting Vomit ranks now too, so they can deal with normal infantry and cav now too.

  2. I was talking base cost. You don't HAVE to make them Big Uns. A minimally upgraded SO unit is nearly as killy as BO and less expensive, and is Core. I cannot stress enough how valuable it is having them as Core.

    Animosity is bad, but not terrible and I recommend people bring a BO BSB anyway, so it will mitigate it for your SO. As far as leadership goes, SO and BO are both ITP out of the gate so BO are only slightly better in that regard, certainly not head and shoulders better though.

    Sorry man, trolls suck. Having to spend points on a Big Boss tax to baby sit them isn't my idea of efficiency in list building. I just don't see them as a competitive choice based on cost vs. killing power and resiliency. They are a fun unit though and by all means take them in friendly games but in a competitive event your points are better spent elsewhere.

  3. I see where your going at, I was just trying to see whether or not I can justify getting a Black Orc unit over some of the other units, which sadly again GW has failed to make them signficantly better than either the core choices or special ones :(

    I'll still field them because of the awesome models, but I hope the next book they give them 2A or some other stat increase to make them more cost-effective/appealing.

    Well guess its time to break out the Immortulz, WS 5 Black Orcs away!

  4. You still got the base cost wrong though, 8 points for savage orcs, 12 points for Black Orcs, NOT 50 percent, you're thinking normal boyz.

  5. 8+(8x0.5)[50%]=8 + 4=12

    That's what he meant. If you are doubling the amount of something then you are talking about 100% increase not 50%.

    Anyway, I was planning to use trolls this way. 4 in a unit 2 wide with 2 rows. Charge them in along with 25 night gobbos. Try co-ordinating the charge in a way that the gobbos will get just barely in contact with the enemy unit. This way you will get the full 12 attacks from the trolls and you'll get the ranks + standard bonus from the gobbos.
    You think something like that would work?

  6. Trolls can work, it just takes effort, heh. Call me lazy, but I don't want to take stuff that has to be forced to be OK. And yes, I meant that 12 points is 50% more than 8 I suck at the maths but I'm glad I was right on that.

  7. Interesting to read your thoughts on Rock Lobbers. You really find at S3 small blast they kill stuff that you should fear in combat? I've been very underwhelmed by their performance in the first 20 games I've played with the new book. I think their greatest value is their S9 hit in the center to take out monsters, but then I use Black Orcs with S7 flaming attacks for that (another thing that Black Orcs do that SO cannot).

    Still, I really appreciated your review and opinions, even though we disagree on most things. :)

  8. There are T3 units that will beat you in combat, or at least never lose to you...

    100 Skaven slaves
    35 Khorne Mauraders with Great Weapons

    ...come to mind. I'm sure there are more. The Getting 9+ str3 hits on those units per turn before they can get to you has some great value.

    And yes,the str9 under the hole hit is valuable against characters riding big things like Skink Priests on EotG.

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  10. Great, now I have to buy 4 more Spear Chukkas and another Doom Diver, thanks for the review..

    Actually the Doom Diver has been performing VERY well in actual games - if it doesn't misfire it's practically an auto-hit if you place the template correctly to begin with. (The template is the small, clear, flight base, by the way..)